I may be stupid but at least I can help with clarifying some of these. Keep in mind Lambic Rumors change every time you hear them. These sort of things change all of the time. So keep that in mind. I\u2019m trying to give factual set in stone info here based on traveling and reading. I\u2019m sure the Lambic Lovers will comment below if I get something wrong.<\/p>\n
\u2014\u2014\u2014-<\/p>\n
Cantillon only uses the Lambic they brew for their Gueuze. Tilquin and 3 Fonteinen (Drie) use Lambic from other breweries. Specifically Boon & Lindemans go into 3 Fonteinen Gueuze and Tilquin is the only Gueuzerie that uses those 2 producers\u2019 Lambic + Lambic from Cantillon (not a lot, by the way as Cantillon is one of the smallest components of Tilquin Gueuze and I believe getting smaller every season)<\/p>\n
So when you say Lindeman\u2019s and Boon have crappy Lambic\u2026keep in mind the best Oude Gueuze on the market now (3 Fonteinen) uses their Lambic. The highest rated beers on RateBeer in Gueuze Blauw, Roze, etc use Lindeman\u2019s lambic. It\u2019s more about the blender\u2019s talents than the juice itself.<\/p>\n
Michael, a new partner of Armand\u2019s (3 Fonteinen) is learning what makes a 3F Oude Gueuze what it is. He\u2019ll be taking over 3F when Armand finally retires. I\u2019ve heard from multiple people the Gueuze hitting shelves this fall will be Michael\u2019s blends, not Armand\u2019s but Armand is obviously still very involved.<\/p>\n
Tilquin does not brew it\u2019s own Lambic yet. 3 Fonteinen just started in December 2012 so within the next year, 3F Oude Gueuze will finally have their own Lambic in it for the first time since I think 2008. Someone correct me there, please.<\/p>\n
What\u2019s the difference between Cantillon Classic Gueuze (yellow label) and 100% Lambic Bio? Nothing. They\u2019re exactly the same. Cantillon\u2019s Gueuze that\u2019s sold in the European Union meets the requirements to be classified as Bio-Organic. In the US, it does not so they use a different label here. They\u2019re the same beer. I\u2019ve heard people actually say that 100% Lambic Bio tastes better than Classic Gueuze. That\u2019s impossible.<\/p>\n
\u2014\u2014\u2014\u2014<\/p>\n
Most people that think anything that\u2019s not 3F, Tilquin and Cantillon Lambic isn\u2019t worth buying. Untrue but in a lot of ways, I can understand why they think that. Most Lambic is sweetened with syrupy candy flavorings, force carbonated and mixed with various juices to appeal to a broader audience. On my first visit to Belgium I ordered Kriek Max, a Lindeman\u2019s product in a bar. It tasted terrible and all of the men around me laughed because \u201cOnly women drink Kriek\u201d which is true. It\u2019s a drink for girls who don\u2019t like \u201cmen\u2019s beer\u201d. Just like Bud Light drinkers in America, women drink flavored wine coolers and real men drinking Bud Light. The non-beer geek of Belgium doesn\u2019t know real lambic exists\u2026they only know that Kriek is for girls and in a lot of ways, they\u2019re right.<\/p>\n
We don\u2019t have Kriek Max in USA but we do have Boon Kriek and Framboise and Hanssens has a lot of various flavored lambic. You can guy crappy Timmermans Pumpkin Lambicus and stuff like that and quickly realize that everything except for 3F, Tilquin and Cantillon sucks.<\/p>\n
But you\u2019re wrong.<\/p>\n
The terms Oude Gueuze & Oude Kriek, within the European Union are protected under law. If you call your product this, you\u2019ll need to meet some basic criteria. Boon Oude Kriek for example is nothing like Boon Kriek. Same for Mort Subite, Lindeman\u2019s, Timmermans and Hanssens. All of these producers have crappy sweetened Lambic and most of them have a Kriek \/ Gueuze product(s) that are made the traditional way and they\u2019re all quite good, drinkable, on shelves all over Belgium and much cheaper than Tilquin, 3 Fonteinen and Cantillon.<\/p>\n
So if you see something called Oude Gueuze on a shelf, grab it and be amazed at how good it is. Cantillon\u2019s gueuze actually scores dead last on my favorite in-production gueuze\u2026actually i take that back.\u00a0Moriau Gueuze is actually the worst. It\u2019s a Boon product and it\u2019s pretty bad.<\/p>\n
In summary, don\u2019t write off a Lambic maker because their non Oude products are bad. They\u2019re supposed to appeal to people who like fruity sweet candy beers and that\u2019s okay. Also, keep in mind that the best gueuze in the world uses Lambic from these supposed \u201ccrappy lambic makers\u201d<\/p>\n
\u2014\u2014\u2014\u2014\u2014-<\/p>\n
One of the most enlightening moments for me when talking about Quality Lambic versus Quality Blending & care of Lambic (transfer, storage, aging, blending, carbonation) is at the Weekend of Spontaneous Fermentation back in 2012. I got to try unblended Lambic from 12+ different producers. I\u2019ve tried a few more since then but I was amazed at how great the Lambic was from some producers who don\u2019t have that great of Oude Gueuze. Basically, the unblended is better than the final production blend. Why is this? The human element of creating Gueuze from Unblended Lambic is the failure point.<\/p>\n
Looking at my own ratings of Unblended Lambic<\/p>\n
![\"Screen](\"http:\/\/adam-jackson.net\/beer\/wp-content\/uploads\/2014\/07\/Screen-Shot-2014-07-18-at-12.14.13-PM.png\")
You\u2019ll see Timmermans, Mort Subite, Girardin and Cantillon score pretty highly. I\u2019d probably rate Lindeman and Boon a bit higher now that I\u2019ve had them a few times. These ratings are BS though because every single batch of Lambic during the brewing season (Winter time when it is below 40 degrees Fahrenheit) is different. Microbial effects, temperature, cooling time, the barrels used and many more variables. I\u2019ve sampled from 5 different Cantillon barrels of Jonge Lambiek and each taste different. You\u2019d need to sample hundreds of barrels from every producer to truly rate unblended Lambic..that\u2019s my opinion, though. But this only reinforces my point that you can have a fantastic barrel of Lambic or a crappy one and the blender can make it to match the brewery\u2019s profile. The human element is critical. So with time as brewers retire, things change, climate changes, brewery expands \/ moves to a new location and even things like different barrel producers change, the lambic and gueuze will change. This makes rating these bottles so difficult. Ideally, there\u2019s a unique entry for every single bottle date of every single Lambic \/ Gueuze \/ Kriek from every producer.\u00a0<\/p>\n
That\u2019ll never happen though.<\/p>\n
I passed 1100 words so I should probably stop writing but I\u2019ll try to do more posts like this as I find time. I think the discussions around what constitutes as Good Lambic is important. HORALs is doing a good job in a lot of ways but not so good in other ways and I think that\u2019s another conversation entirely. \u00a0Also, I didn\u2019t proofread this one. So there are typos.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"I\u2019m an idiot when it comes to beer and especially toward Lambic but the same goes for most…\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"jetpack_post_was_ever_published":false,"apple_news_api_created_at":"2018-12-07T17:36:59Z","apple_news_api_id":"7429aa91-600e-41d1-ab25-adc07c565541","apple_news_api_modified_at":"2018-12-07T17:37:03Z","apple_news_api_revision":"AAAAAAAAAAD\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/w==","apple_news_api_share_url":"https:\/\/apple.news\/AdCmqkWAOQdGrJa3AfFZVQQ","apple_news_cover_media_provider":"image","apple_news_coverimage":0,"apple_news_coverimage_caption":"","apple_news_cover_video_id":0,"apple_news_cover_video_url":"","apple_news_cover_embedwebvideo_url":"","apple_news_is_hidden":"","apple_news_is_paid":"","apple_news_is_preview":"","apple_news_is_sponsored":"","apple_news_maturity_rating":"","apple_news_metadata":"\"\"","apple_news_pullquote":"","apple_news_pullquote_position":"","apple_news_slug":"","apple_news_sections":[],"apple_news_suppress_video_url":false,"apple_news_use_image_component":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_access":"","_jetpack_dont_email_post_to_subs":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_tier_id":0,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paywalled_content":false,"csco_singular_sidebar":"","csco_page_header_type":"","csco_custom_appearance":"","csco_disable_excerpt_posts_layout":false,"csco_page_load_nextpost":"","csco_post_video_location":[],"csco_post_video_location_hash":"","csco_post_video_url":"","csco_post_video_bg_start_time":0,"csco_post_video_bg_end_time":0,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":true,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","default_image_id":0,"font":"","enabled":false},"version":2}},"categories":[9],"tags":[],"class_list":{"0":"post-2307","1":"post","2":"type-post","3":"status-publish","4":"format-standard","6":"category-my-thoughts","7":"cs-entry","8":"cs-video-wrap"},"apple_news_notices":[],"jetpack_publicize_connections":[],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"","jetpack_shortlink":"https:\/\/wp.me\/pb3IC4-Bd","jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":7776,"url":"https:\/\/adamchandler.me\/blog\/2015\/01\/05\/site-news-gueuze-fest-starting-in-a-few-days\/","url_meta":{"origin":2307,"position":0},"title":"\u2605 Site News: Gueuze-Fest Starting in a few days","author":"Adam Chandler","date":"January 5, 2015","format":false,"excerpt":"I\u2019ve been passively trying to get more Lambic-Gueuze reviews lately and on RateBeer, I\u2019ve had 59 different Gueuze since joining in January of 2012. There are 41 I have not had for a total on RateBeer of 100 unique entries globally. Not all of these are actual Lambiek and some\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "Site News"","block_context":{"text":"Site News","link":"https:\/\/adamchandler.me\/blog\/category\/site-news\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"Belgian Gueuze & Kriek","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/farm8.staticflickr.com\/7580\/16028948319_6e5ef8f09d_z.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/farm8.staticflickr.com\/7580\/16028948319_6e5ef8f09d_z.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/farm8.staticflickr.com\/7580\/16028948319_6e5ef8f09d_z.jpg?resize=525%2C300&ssl=1 1.5x"},"classes":[]},{"id":2369,"url":"https:\/\/adamchandler.me\/blog\/2014\/08\/27\/armand-debelder-3-fonteinen-gueuze-a-few-thoughts\/","url_meta":{"origin":2307,"position":1},"title":"\u2605 Armand Debelder & 3 Fonteinen Gueuze (a few thoughts)","author":"Adam Chandler","date":"August 27, 2014","format":false,"excerpt":"Last month, I wrote this post about some knowledge of Lambic I\u2019ve picked up over the past 2 years. There are Lambic lovers all over the world that know more than me and I certainly respect their knowledge. Some are total assholes about how much they know and given that\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "My Thoughts"","block_context":{"text":"My Thoughts","link":"https:\/\/adamchandler.me\/blog\/category\/my-thoughts\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"3 Fonteinen 50th Anniversary 1998 - Oude Gueze","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/farm4.staticflickr.com\/3895\/14974656361_630feccaab_z.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":2786,"url":"https:\/\/adamchandler.me\/blog\/2015\/05\/19\/review-cantillon-goldackerl-gueuze\/","url_meta":{"origin":2307,"position":2},"title":"\u2605 Review: Cantillon Goldackerl Gueuze","author":"Adam Chandler","date":"May 19, 2015","format":false,"excerpt":"\u00a0Overall 4.4\u00a0\u00a0 AROMA 8\/10\u00a0\u00a0 APPEARANCE 5\/5\u00a0\u00a0 TASTE 9\/10\u00a0\u00a0 PALATE 4\/5\u00a0\u00a0 OVERALL 18\/20 AdamJackson\u00a0(3386) 75CL Bottle split 4 ways A - Very dark golden orange color. A nice 2 finger head at first but faded fast S - The nose is very interesting. Very grape forward. Almost wine like with a\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "Reviews"","block_context":{"text":"Reviews","link":"https:\/\/adamchandler.me\/blog\/category\/reviews\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"Cantillon Goldackerl Gueuze","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/farm8.staticflickr.com\/7746\/17408788855_4e557318aa_z.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":395,"url":"https:\/\/adamchandler.me\/blog\/2012\/06\/22\/beer-haul-june-2012-post-belgium-extravaganza\/","url_meta":{"origin":2307,"position":3},"title":"\u2605 Beer Haul: June 2012 (Post-Belgium Extravaganza)","author":"Adam Chandler","date":"June 22, 2012","format":false,"excerpt":"I'm back from Belgium and it took a few weeks for my packages to arrive. They were all intercepted by Customs but nothing was seized which is nice. This is a sizable amount of beer and, before I post photos, I'd like to say a few things. 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The 2015 edition took place on\u2026","rel":"","context":"In "Travel"","block_context":{"text":"Travel","link":"https:\/\/adamchandler.me\/blog\/category\/travel\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"De Troche - Toer de Gueuze 2015","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/farm9.staticflickr.com\/8802\/17177104917_d3e82c8891_z.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/farm9.staticflickr.com\/8802\/17177104917_d3e82c8891_z.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/farm9.staticflickr.com\/8802\/17177104917_d3e82c8891_z.jpg?resize=525%2C300&ssl=1 1.5x"},"classes":[]},{"id":381,"url":"https:\/\/adamchandler.me\/blog\/2012\/06\/07\/review-a-collection-of-bottled-lambic-beers\/","url_meta":{"origin":2307,"position":5},"title":"\u2605 Review: A Collection of Bottled Lambic Beers","author":"Adam Chandler","date":"June 7, 2012","format":false,"excerpt":"Myself and 4 friends ordered these bottles simultaneously at the Weekend of Spontaneous Fermentation 2012. 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